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Olds Flugelhorn Serial Numbers

An archive of user submitted F.E. Olds instrument serial numbers. The Olds Register. Serial number. Instrument type. All other information below is optional, but would be greatly appreciated if included. Bell Material. Super tone ring. Only 'Super' & 'Super Recording' models have tone rings. The serial number is 276073 making the year of manufacture at about 1959. According to reliable sources the model is L12 and is one of the earliest of the Olds flugelhorn line which was first manufactured in 1959. Olds & Son History and Featured Instruments Click on an image below for the story. Olds Trumpet and Cornet Serial Numbers. Olds Catalogs, 1925 to 1927. An archive of user submitted F.E. Olds instrument serial numbers.

This is an approximate guide to deciphering the meaning of the numbers and letters used to create the model numbers used on Yamaha Trumpets

1st Number - Range or Grade

The pre-1982 range of Yamaha Trumpets with three digit model numbers appear to have been marketed as such:

1xx : Standard / College

2xx : Standard / College

3xx : Standard / College

6xx : Professional

7xx : Professional

9xx : Custom

Does anyone have any old brochures or marketing material from this time that they are willing to sent to me or share as a .pdf?

Post-1982 with the change to the 4 digit model numbers, the marketing material suggests the following.

T-xxx : T Series (Student?)

xxx-Q : Q-Class (2005 only, Student?)

xxx-AD : Advantage (Student?)

1xxx : Standard

2xxx : Standard

3xxx : Intermediate

4xx : Intermediate (Rotary only)

4xxx : Intermediate

5xxx : Allegro (introduced 2010 - , intermediate?)

6xx : Professional (Flugel range only)

6xxx : Professional

6xxxH : Professional Heavywieght (introduced 1987, replaced by Xeno Range)

6xxxH : Maestro Range (UK Brass Band marketing, now marketed as NEO range except cornets)

6xxx : Professional Signature Series (Bob Shew, etc..)

8xx : Custom (Unique Japan only medium bore range)

8xxxH : Pre-Xeno (Custom?) (Japan only) 1986-1990

8xxxUS : Xeno I (Japan only, 1990-1994)

8xxxUSII: Xeno II (Japan only, 1994-2001

8xxx : Xeno (international model, 2001-)

8xxxZ : Custom Z (Bobby Shew)

9xx : Custom (Rotary only)

9xxx : Xeno Artist Series (Chicago, New York etc. introduced 2005-)

9xxx : Custom

9xxx : Custom Artist (Allen Vizzutti, Bergeron, etc..)

As you can see there is quite a lot of varience in the way models are described, breaking away from the Range/Key/Bore/Model number structure.

2nd Number - Key or Pitch

I think this seems to be fairly well established, although the listed items in italics are more theoretical.

1 - Bb Bass (eg: YTR-916) (as only one set of custom made Bass Trumpets exist it is hard to say whether this was the intent of the the series number but it seems to make sense although doesn't fit into the 3 digit model numbers.)

2 - Eb Alto (no known Eb Alto trumpets exist but it would make sense that the number 2 was reserved for this pitch.)

Isp programmer software. 3 - Bb (eg: YTR-6335)

4 - C (eg: YTR-8445)

5 - D (eg: YTR-651)

6 - Eb/D (eg: YTR-6610)

7 - G/F (eg: YTR-9710)

8 - Bb/A Piccolo (eg: YTR-6810)

9 - C Piccolo (eg: YTR-9910)

3rd Number - Bore Size

I think this was probably the intended system when the 4 digit model numbers were developed, but it just seems to dissappear in any organised form as more models have been introduced into the range. There simply isn't enough (appropriate) numbers to accomodate all the possible bores in a logical sequence. Also worth noting is the variance of measurements in the same bore sizes. I'd like to work out if this is a deliberate change of measurement made by Yamaha for speccific models or simply anj case of the original imperial measurements being changed to decimal and back again, each time changing slightly for the previous. Any thoughts or knowledge in this area? The measurements I have are as follows:

1 = Step Bore (YTR-6310Z)

2 = M (Medium) (YTR-6320)

Olds Flugelhorn Serial Numbers List

3 = ML (Medium Large) (YTR-6335)

4 = L (Large) (eg: YTR-8445

But this doesn't have space for the S (Small) Bore or MS (Medium Small) bore, nor does it differentiate between same bore sizes, so I'll list the measurements in order and assume that the number system simply doesn't hold true anymore, other than maybe the 3 and 4 designation.

Step Bore

S = 10.50mm / xxx' (eg: YTR-6810)

MS = 11.00mm / 0.433' (eg: YFH-631)

M = 11.24mm / 0.442' (eg: YTR-946)

M = 11.25mm / 0.443' (eg: YTR-948FFMS)

Olds Super Star Flugelhorn

M = 11.30mm / 0.445' (eg: YTR-6310)

ML = 11.65mm / 0.459' (eg: YTR-6335H)

ML = 11.68mm / xxx' (eg: YTR-4335G)

L = 11.73mm / 0.462' (eg: YCR-2310II)

L = 11.76mm / xxx' (eg: YTR-6340)

L = 11.90mm / 0.469' (eg: YCR-8335)

If anyone wants to supply me with the correct fractional imperial measurements it would be appreciated.

4th Number - Model, Version or Design Series

I'm assuming the 4th number was originally intended to designate the model or design within a particular set up. Ie: a 6335 and 6330B are both Proffesional Level, Bb, and ML bore, but the final number differentiates between the actual design of the trumpet. for example, one may or may not have a 2 piece bell vs a 1 piece bell, a gold brass vs yellow brass or even the same but with slightly different brace positions. I think that this system worked initially until model models and artists developed and this system simply ceased to work as intended. The addition of letters as described below has been introduced to help over come the limited combinations of numbers only. As far as I can tell there is no specific meaning to each number other than to differentiate one from others.

Flugelhorn Sound

EDIT: I have realized that this description is not actually correct for the last number. It basically alternates between a '0' or a '5' (with a few exceptions). The '0' represents trumpets with a reverse construction leadpipe, and the '5' represents a standard construction leadpipe. Of course this doesn't hold true for the higher pitched trumpets with tuning bells and adjustable receivers etc.

Letters

The use of letters is inconsistent so needs to be looked at individually for each model really.

S = Silver Plate. The letter 'S' is used to denote Silver Plating. It is not used to denote a Small Bore even though the 'Custom' range of Bb and C trumpets from 1982-85 started including the bore size in the model number similar to Bach's (eg: YTR-9330ML). Additionally, note that 'S' is NOT used for ALL silver plated instruments though. It would appear that the 'S' is only used when a particular model is offered in both a lacquered version and silver plate version. If a model is only available in a silver plate configuration it would appear that the 'S' is not used, eg: YTR-9610. This is made more confusing as Yamaha themselves market some particular trumpets with an 'S' in their marketing material but not actually stamped on the same instument, eg: the Xeno Artist Series trumpets, only available in silver plate but marketed by Yamaha as YTR-8445CHS in all of their published material. When you look at the actual instruments, they are stamped as YTR-8445CH. I guess if you are looking at purchasing a Yamaha trumpet 2nd hand you must know what configurations it was originally offered in before knowing if a particular instrument has been modified or not. Also note that there is NO denotation for a lacquered instrument. I deperately need more close up photos of model number to actually confirm what is actually being done by Yamaha.

GP = Gold Plate. The letters 'GP' have been used for a very few select models offered with gold plating as the only available finish or as an option. It would appear that gold plating is available as an option from the factory through their Custom Workshop or Alteliers. Genrally, I believe that gold plating is applied over silver plating or nickel as it does not adhere to raw brass very well, and as such most gold plated Yamaha trumpets will have started life as a lacquered or silver plate version of the trumpet.

GL = Gold Lacquer. I have found one instance of this being used to denote a tinted Gold Lacquer in a range available with standard clear lacquer also. Not used anywhere else even when Gold Lacquer is used.

W = Raw Brass. The only instances of the letter W being used are on a particular range of rotary trumpets and flugel horns designed in conjunction with the Vienna Philharmonic orchestra, based on the Heckel model trumpets.

B = Black Lacquer. A few models have been released in 2010/11 as limited editions finished in Black coloured Lacquer. Used in the Yamaha saxophone range for a while but new to the trumpet range.

G = Gold Brass Bell. The letter 'G' is used to denote a bell made from Gold Brass. Again, it was originally only used when a model was available in two different versions, a Gold Brass belled version and a Yellow Brass version. If the model was only available with a gold brass bell it was not used. In more recent models it appears to be used even if the model is only available with a gold brass bell, I would presume as a marketing tool by Yamaha. In the earlier 3 digit models, it appears that there is the occasional use of rose brass, a higher copper content again, but ther is no letter used to indicate this. I have not found any material to classify the percentage of copper in each of the bell materials yet, in a fashion simialr to those used by Vincent Bach on each of the individual shop cards he kept for every single trumpet. Note that this does not have any bearing on the material used in the leadpipe.

R = Reverse Construction Leadpipe. Again, this letter is only used when a model is available with both a standard or a reverse construction leadpipe. It is not used when it is only available with one or the other. There is no letter used to denote the material used to construct the leadpipe.

T = Trigger. Used to denote a mechanical trigger for either the 1st valve slide or the 3rd valve slide. It is model dependent as to which slide it is. Again, only use where the trigger is an option within a particular model range, although i think there are instances where it is used just as a marketing tool on models where it is the oonly set-up.

DT = Double Trigger. Denotes a trigger on BOTH the 1st and 3rd valve slides. It appears this has only been used once on a 6000 series of cornets before the introduction of the Maestro and Xeno range. Whilst the later cornets are supplied with double triggers the 'DT' are not used.

You Serial Numbers

RH = Ring and Hook. Only seen on the YCR-8335SRH, it is used to denote a 3rd valve slide fixed ring and 1st valve slide thumb hook (saddle). Different from the standard models supplied with both 1st and 3rd slide triggers.

H = Heavyweight. Denotes a heavyweight constructin of the overall trumpet. It appears the 'H' designation appeared in the mide 1980's in Japan and then became international with the introduction of the 'Heavyweight' 6000 range, and subsequent series II of the same range. Up until this point the Yamaha trumpet range was all medium to lightweight in a similar fashion to the Schilke range of instruments. Since the introduction of the heavyweight Xeno range the 'H' designation has ceased to be used. Note that there is no letter to denote Lightweight or Medium-weight.

II = 2nd Series. The 'II' indicates the 2nd development of the same model. One might descride it as an 'improved' version of the same model. It is sometimes hard to pin point what the actual change / improvement is. It might be anytrhing from a change in thickness of bell material, a change of brace design to the addition of a water key.

Olds Trumpet Serial Numbers List

U = ???. The letter U appears on a select few of the Japanese only models of the Xeno I and Xeno II range before it was made internationally available. I have no idea what it actually indicates or means. 'Udon noodles?'